The following is an edited transcript of an interview between Daily Wire Editor-in-Chief John Bickley and the president and CEO of Alliance Defending Freedom Kristen Waggoner on a Saturday edition of Morning Wire.
* * *
President Trump has returned to office with an extremely ambitious agenda – and has immediately taken executive action to jump start what he’s promising will be a transformative year for the nation. Among the issues he’s already begun to address is reversing the Biden administration’s policies on gender identity and Diversity Equity and Inclusion. Morning Wire sat down with the president and CEO of Alliance Defending Freedom, a legal group that has been leading the charge on gender and DEI cases, to discuss Trump’s actions and cultural shifts on the issues.
* * *
JOHN: Joining us now to discuss Trump’s executive action on gender and DEI is Alliance Defending Freedom President and CEO Kristen Waggoner. First of all, thank you so much for coming on.
KRISTEN: Thanks for having me.
JOHN: I wanted to start with the big picture. We just witnessed a historic – on so many levels – inauguration, the biggest political comeback in American history. In terms of the larger issues that your organization in particular is really concerned with, what does this mean for the future of the country in the coming four years?
KRISTEN: We’re thrilled with the promises that President Trump has made with regard to the revolution of common sense. That’s what he referred to in his inaugural speech, that we’re going to return back toward reality, toward common sense, and the rule of law. And I think what it means for practical purposes is that he is intending to use the federal government to ensure we eradicate a toxic ideology that has wreaked havoc on Americans, both in terms of safety, opportunities, and freedom.
JOHN: Yes, let’s unpack that. I know that gender ideology has been a key priority for your organization. The Daily Wire has also been very focused on this issue. What are we seeing coming from the Trump administration on gender-related policies?
KRISTEN: The Trump administration has issued a number of executive orders that deal with gender identity as well as censorship and DEI in the federal government, and all of those come together to essentially restore the legal and scientifically sound definition of sex in federal law, meaning that we are created male and female, and that sex is neither chosen nor changed. And that will have tremendous implications, both on women’s rights, with regard to sports, fairness, privacy, locker rooms, also what our children are being taught, and in numerous other areas.
Photo by Anna Moneymaker/Getty Images
JOHN: The Biden administration aggressively pushed progressive gender ideology – how much has that impacted schools, local organizations – how pervasive has this actually been?
KRISTEN: Well, at Alliance Defending Freedom we have represented scores of female athletes that have been deprived not only of fairness on the athletic field, but also privacy in locker rooms, in dorm rooms, in showers, and safety. We also have represented students who have been deprived of free speech, and counselors and teachers who have been deprived of free speech, compelled to use pronouns that don’t reflect biological truth. We have represented parents who have been deprived of decision-making authority for kids and teachers deprived of conscience rights. And we’ve even seen schools that have been deprived of certain funding mechanisms because of this ideology. President Trump has issued an order telling the agencies in the executive branch that they can, they must stop infusing all of these areas of federal law with this notion that we are created something other than male or female.
JOHN: Do we expect to still see states like California undermine this effort or are there federal levers that can push back against the attempts to continue this kind of ideologically crammed down in schools?
KRISTEN: I guarantee you, you’ll see states like California, New York, and Washington try to undermine these executive orders. And because of the way that our system of government is set out, there will be bad states that will continue to try to undermine the rights of American citizens. And there will be litigation that continues. But the difference here is they can no longer say that federal law requires this, in terms of the agency action. And now the power of the federal government in all of the places that it shows up is actually on the opposite side of this fight. And in addition, the Trump administration can go a step further, and it can deprive institutions as well as state governments of federal funding when they refuse to recognize biological reality and common sense.
JOHN: From a legal perspective, does the federal government coming out against this ideology, does it further expose these local entities, the school boards, etc. to legal ramifications for promoting something that could be dangerous or unfair to women and girls?
KRISTEN: It should do so, assuming that the administrative agencies are putting teeth in these actions. So again, the way that the government works is the executive branch, the president sets the agenda and tells the agencies what to do. Then it’s the agencies that create the guidance and enforce what the president has said in federal law. So it will be critical that the agencies follow this direction and put real teeth into this by denying federal funding and by going after those states and those educational institutions that are not honoring the rights of Americans in this area.
JOHN: Now, Alliance Defending Freedom has been fighting on this front for a while now. Are you guys seeing progress, generally speaking, in terms of the legal arguments against gender ideology?
KRISTEN: We are seeing progress, but there still is an uphill battle. I think my hope is that we’re turning the corner on this issue. For years, we’ve been fighting it for over 10 years now with regard to bathrooms, locker rooms, and, more recently, eight or so years on the sports front. I think we’re turning the page. But again, we have half of the states that have adopted laws to protect women and girls in sports as an example. And these are state laws. Those are being challenged and argued that they are unconstitutional. So those cases will continue, but we will continue now to have the federal government on the side of women and girls, rather than against us. I also think we can’t possibly underestimate the importance of the federal government saying there are two sexes and that you cannot choose nor change biological reality – because that will play out in many different ways across the government, and it will stop the social engineering that we’ve been seeing that’s happening through the power of the federal government.
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JOHN: Now, you mentioned at the top that DEI is a big part of what the Trump administration is trying to weed out. This is something the Biden administration heavily focused on in a way we’ve never seen before. What kinds of actions from Trump are we seeing there, and what do we expect in the coming years?
KRISTEN: The executive order that President Trump issued today on DEI is so critical because it removes DEI from federal government policies, and he was right to do so because DEI essentially is an attempt to socially engineer gender ideology and race into every facet of American life and the very first step to take that back and to, as President Trump said, have a revolution of common sense is to, again, rid the government of DEI programs because it’s a proven failure. It introduces risk, legal risk, it eliminates people advancing on the basis of merit, and it destroys unity, which President Trump has said is a high priority for him.
JOHN: The Daily Wire is very interested in the intersection of politics and culture. We’re very much believers in politics being downstream of culture, and that we have to not only fight against forces cramming down dangerous policies but we have to build and shape culture. How have cultural shifts influenced the issues of gender and DEI?
KRISTEN: They’ve been profoundly impactful. I would say that law and culture work together. You can’t have one without the other, and one doesn’t necessarily lead the other, but they both impact one another. And so I would just say, especially the work that The Daily Wire has done has been so critical in our efforts, as an example, on the gender identity front, because the principle that you’re establishing in the court before the Supreme Court, or a principle you’re establishing in a state or federal law, it has to be plausible to the American people. It has to make sense to them. And Daily Wire, for example, has been one of the first that has come out and spoken clearly, succinctly, and without fear, with courage, on the importance of biological reality. When the law doesn’t recognize the biological differences between men and women, families get hurt. And most importantly, women and girls will suffer not only from equal opportunities, but they will lose their rights.
The Daily Wire
JOHN: Final question. We’ve seen a flurry of activity from the Trump administration and his opening salvo on reshaping the federal government. What else are you seeing in terms of this new administration’s priorities?
KRISTEN: I think of all of the priorities that he set out, they come back to one primary theme — he’s recognizing the stifling authoritarianism that we’ve seen at home, here in the United States, and that we’re witnessing abroad. As some of our members of our international team have also said, the entire world is watching right now, and they are rooting for Americans and for President Trump to turn the corner on this – in a moment throughout the world that wants to return to the concept of inalienable rights, that wants to return to the rule of law and to a government that recognizes common sense values. So whether that’s on immigration and what’s happening at the border, whether it’s weaponization of the federal government and the justice system against one’s enemies, as we have seen, to censorship, which President Trump has said is a high priority for him to stop censorship. The world is watching and what is most important now is what happens next. And I think the whole world is cheering for him and his administration to follow through on its promises in these areas.
JOHN: Well, there was massive anticipation heading into this week – and now very high hopes for what’s ahead. Kristen, thank you so much for talking with us.
KRISTEN: Thanks for having me.
JOHN: That was Kristen Waggoner, CEO and president of Alliance Defending Freedom – and this has been a weekend edition of Morning Wire.
***
[#item_full_content]
[[{“value”:”
The following is an edited transcript of an interview between Daily Wire Editor-in-Chief John Bickley and the president and CEO of Alliance Defending Freedom Kristen Waggoner on a Saturday edition of Morning Wire.
* * *
President Trump has returned to office with an extremely ambitious agenda – and has immediately taken executive action to jump start what he’s promising will be a transformative year for the nation. Among the issues he’s already begun to address is reversing the Biden administration’s policies on gender identity and Diversity Equity and Inclusion. Morning Wire sat down with the president and CEO of Alliance Defending Freedom, a legal group that has been leading the charge on gender and DEI cases, to discuss Trump’s actions and cultural shifts on the issues.
* * *
JOHN: Joining us now to discuss Trump’s executive action on gender and DEI is Alliance Defending Freedom President and CEO Kristen Waggoner. First of all, thank you so much for coming on.
KRISTEN: Thanks for having me.
JOHN: I wanted to start with the big picture. We just witnessed a historic – on so many levels – inauguration, the biggest political comeback in American history. In terms of the larger issues that your organization in particular is really concerned with, what does this mean for the future of the country in the coming four years?
KRISTEN: We’re thrilled with the promises that President Trump has made with regard to the revolution of common sense. That’s what he referred to in his inaugural speech, that we’re going to return back toward reality, toward common sense, and the rule of law. And I think what it means for practical purposes is that he is intending to use the federal government to ensure we eradicate a toxic ideology that has wreaked havoc on Americans, both in terms of safety, opportunities, and freedom.
JOHN: Yes, let’s unpack that. I know that gender ideology has been a key priority for your organization. The Daily Wire has also been very focused on this issue. What are we seeing coming from the Trump administration on gender-related policies?
KRISTEN: The Trump administration has issued a number of executive orders that deal with gender identity as well as censorship and DEI in the federal government, and all of those come together to essentially restore the legal and scientifically sound definition of sex in federal law, meaning that we are created male and female, and that sex is neither chosen nor changed. And that will have tremendous implications, both on women’s rights, with regard to sports, fairness, privacy, locker rooms, also what our children are being taught, and in numerous other areas.
Photo by Anna Moneymaker/Getty Images
JOHN: The Biden administration aggressively pushed progressive gender ideology – how much has that impacted schools, local organizations – how pervasive has this actually been?
KRISTEN: Well, at Alliance Defending Freedom we have represented scores of female athletes that have been deprived not only of fairness on the athletic field, but also privacy in locker rooms, in dorm rooms, in showers, and safety. We also have represented students who have been deprived of free speech, and counselors and teachers who have been deprived of free speech, compelled to use pronouns that don’t reflect biological truth. We have represented parents who have been deprived of decision-making authority for kids and teachers deprived of conscience rights. And we’ve even seen schools that have been deprived of certain funding mechanisms because of this ideology. President Trump has issued an order telling the agencies in the executive branch that they can, they must stop infusing all of these areas of federal law with this notion that we are created something other than male or female.
JOHN: Do we expect to still see states like California undermine this effort or are there federal levers that can push back against the attempts to continue this kind of ideologically crammed down in schools?
KRISTEN: I guarantee you, you’ll see states like California, New York, and Washington try to undermine these executive orders. And because of the way that our system of government is set out, there will be bad states that will continue to try to undermine the rights of American citizens. And there will be litigation that continues. But the difference here is they can no longer say that federal law requires this, in terms of the agency action. And now the power of the federal government in all of the places that it shows up is actually on the opposite side of this fight. And in addition, the Trump administration can go a step further, and it can deprive institutions as well as state governments of federal funding when they refuse to recognize biological reality and common sense.
JOHN: From a legal perspective, does the federal government coming out against this ideology, does it further expose these local entities, the school boards, etc. to legal ramifications for promoting something that could be dangerous or unfair to women and girls?
KRISTEN: It should do so, assuming that the administrative agencies are putting teeth in these actions. So again, the way that the government works is the executive branch, the president sets the agenda and tells the agencies what to do. Then it’s the agencies that create the guidance and enforce what the president has said in federal law. So it will be critical that the agencies follow this direction and put real teeth into this by denying federal funding and by going after those states and those educational institutions that are not honoring the rights of Americans in this area.
JOHN: Now, Alliance Defending Freedom has been fighting on this front for a while now. Are you guys seeing progress, generally speaking, in terms of the legal arguments against gender ideology?
KRISTEN: We are seeing progress, but there still is an uphill battle. I think my hope is that we’re turning the corner on this issue. For years, we’ve been fighting it for over 10 years now with regard to bathrooms, locker rooms, and, more recently, eight or so years on the sports front. I think we’re turning the page. But again, we have half of the states that have adopted laws to protect women and girls in sports as an example. And these are state laws. Those are being challenged and argued that they are unconstitutional. So those cases will continue, but we will continue now to have the federal government on the side of women and girls, rather than against us. I also think we can’t possibly underestimate the importance of the federal government saying there are two sexes and that you cannot choose nor change biological reality – because that will play out in many different ways across the government, and it will stop the social engineering that we’ve been seeing that’s happening through the power of the federal government.
CELEBRATE #47 WITH 47% OFF DAILYWIRE+ MEMBERSHIPS + A FREE $20 GIFT
JOHN: Now, you mentioned at the top that DEI is a big part of what the Trump administration is trying to weed out. This is something the Biden administration heavily focused on in a way we’ve never seen before. What kinds of actions from Trump are we seeing there, and what do we expect in the coming years?
KRISTEN: The executive order that President Trump issued today on DEI is so critical because it removes DEI from federal government policies, and he was right to do so because DEI essentially is an attempt to socially engineer gender ideology and race into every facet of American life and the very first step to take that back and to, as President Trump said, have a revolution of common sense is to, again, rid the government of DEI programs because it’s a proven failure. It introduces risk, legal risk, it eliminates people advancing on the basis of merit, and it destroys unity, which President Trump has said is a high priority for him.
JOHN: The Daily Wire is very interested in the intersection of politics and culture. We’re very much believers in politics being downstream of culture, and that we have to not only fight against forces cramming down dangerous policies but we have to build and shape culture. How have cultural shifts influenced the issues of gender and DEI?
KRISTEN: They’ve been profoundly impactful. I would say that law and culture work together. You can’t have one without the other, and one doesn’t necessarily lead the other, but they both impact one another. And so I would just say, especially the work that The Daily Wire has done has been so critical in our efforts, as an example, on the gender identity front, because the principle that you’re establishing in the court before the Supreme Court, or a principle you’re establishing in a state or federal law, it has to be plausible to the American people. It has to make sense to them. And Daily Wire, for example, has been one of the first that has come out and spoken clearly, succinctly, and without fear, with courage, on the importance of biological reality. When the law doesn’t recognize the biological differences between men and women, families get hurt. And most importantly, women and girls will suffer not only from equal opportunities, but they will lose their rights.
The Daily Wire
JOHN: Final question. We’ve seen a flurry of activity from the Trump administration and his opening salvo on reshaping the federal government. What else are you seeing in terms of this new administration’s priorities?
KRISTEN: I think of all of the priorities that he set out, they come back to one primary theme — he’s recognizing the stifling authoritarianism that we’ve seen at home, here in the United States, and that we’re witnessing abroad. As some of our members of our international team have also said, the entire world is watching right now, and they are rooting for Americans and for President Trump to turn the corner on this – in a moment throughout the world that wants to return to the concept of inalienable rights, that wants to return to the rule of law and to a government that recognizes common sense values. So whether that’s on immigration and what’s happening at the border, whether it’s weaponization of the federal government and the justice system against one’s enemies, as we have seen, to censorship, which President Trump has said is a high priority for him to stop censorship. The world is watching and what is most important now is what happens next. And I think the whole world is cheering for him and his administration to follow through on its promises in these areas.
JOHN: Well, there was massive anticipation heading into this week – and now very high hopes for what’s ahead. Kristen, thank you so much for talking with us.
KRISTEN: Thanks for having me.
JOHN: That was Kristen Waggoner, CEO and president of Alliance Defending Freedom – and this has been a weekend edition of Morning Wire.
***
“}]]
